Last Updated on 6 months ago by Charbel Coorey

Kerry O’Keeffe believes Australia will pick Marnus Labuschagne for the Ashes. In an exclusive interview for CricBlog, O’Keeffe generously shared his thoughts on the Australian Test lineup; specifically the challenges facing selectors, and the importance of experience and form as Australia aim to retain the urn.

We covered everything from the potential opening combinations, to the tactical value of Steve Smith as captain and fitness concerns surrounding Pat Cummins. Below is our interview with Kerry O’Keeffe in both audio and text format.

Kerry O’Keeffe interview: Ashes preview and discussing promising talents coming through in Australia

Who should open and bat three for Australia in the Ashes?

Charbel Coorey: So plenty going on, as you know, in the lead up to the Ashes. And I just wanted to ask you, during the Australia-South Africa T20I series, you said you’d have Jake Weatherald as opener, with Jason Sangha at three. Do you still have the same view after the first round of the Sheffield Shield, given that [Matt] Renshaw and [Marnus] Labuschagne notched up tons [against Tasmania]?

Kerry O’Keeffe: No, I’ve changed my view. I was looking a little long-term because I’m fearing when players start to retire. And I was looking in a couple of years, and I was trying to fast-track Jason Sangha, who I think will replace Steve Smith at four in a couple of years’ time.

But he [Sangha] hasn’t seized his opportunity at the start of this season. Weatherald has. I’m a big fan of Jake Weatherald.

I like left-handedness against this England attack. I noted in the last series against India that although Shubman Gill and KL Rahul scored early, all the left-handers got runs. [Yashasvi] Jaiswal, [Ravindra] Jadeja, Washington Sundar, Rishabh Pant. I think there’s a big trend there that if you’re left-handed, you do well against this England bowling attack. And I quite fancied Weatherald and Khawaja at the top of the order, two left-handers, to play in a Hayden-Langer-type style.

But since then, of course, Marnus Labuschagne, everybody is talking, what do we do with Marnus? Well, I sense, Charbel, that he’ll stay in the team because he’s told friends of mine at the start of the season; “what will you do, Marnie, if the selectors terminate your Test career? He said, oh, they won’t because I’ll score so many runs in the pre-series that they won’t be able to ignore me.”

Well, he’s got 130 in the first List A match, 160 in the first Sheffield Shield match, and he’s just completed another 100 for Queensland in the List A match against Tasmania. So he’s got three hundreds in just over a week. His claims will be hard to ignore.

I think they may open with him. I just think that although I’d go Weatherald-Khawaja, I think they’ll go Marnus-Khawaja, because these first two Tests are going to be very testing.

The Optus Test in Perth could end in three days. You don’t really want a debutant caught on an edgy pitch like that, and then it’s straight to a pink ball day-nighter in Brisbane. That would be the most difficult first two Tests of a career. So given that Marnus was the number one Test batter just over two years ago, I think they’ll back he’s served them well in the past.

He’s been in a bit of a lull, but he’s back in form playing in his traditional method. And I think that will allow Green and Webster to stay in the team.

I’d probably elevate Steve Smith to three and have Green at four, given that Pat [Cummins] may be absent for, if not all the Tests, at least a couple, and that Webster and Green are going to have to shoulder some bowling.

Charbel Coorey: I think I agree with your original view about Weatherald because his strike rate’s good and that can complement Khawaja. He struck at what, late 60s last season, an average of 50-odd, so that could be a really good pick. Yeah, but just where they fit the guys, especially if they want to play the two all-rounders? So that’s a tricky one.

Kerry O’Keeffe: It is. I know you follow the game very closely, you know the game, but Cameron Green is seen as a generational talent.

I’m not so convinced. I think he’s an outstanding player. I’m a big fan. I love his technique. I love when he gets on top of bowlers, but they basically convinced Smith he should open so that Green could bat four a couple of summers ago.

Now they’re probably going to push Marnus up to open so Green can bat three. They’re doing a lot of side-stepping to fully mature Cameron Green. It may be the right way to go, but with his bowling, can you bat three in a Test match and bowl 12 to 15 overs? That is a question.

Why Steve Smith as captain can be a big advantage for Australia

Charbel Coorey: Yeah, that’s a big question. I don’t know about Green at three. I’d have him four at the absolute highest.

Kerry O’Keeffe: Yes, I think that’s a fair call. Smith’s record at number three in Test cricket is better than his record at four, so you don’t lose anything. I think he averages 67 at three and 60 at four.

Plus, he’ll be the captain, Charbel, and England fear him. That’s the key. He just marmalises England and has done for years.

His record as captain is superior with the bat than it is as a player. There’s lots of pluses, even though the minus is Pat Cummins not being there. The fact that Smith is the likely captain adds more than Cummins’ loss to this team. Maybe he [Smith] should be the three.

Charbel Coorey: Smith tactically is awesome. He fit in perfectly in that India series a couple of years ago when Cummins had to leave early. We don’t lose much in terms of the captaincy there. I agree.

Kerry O’Keeffe: You’ve seen how tactically strong he is.

Charbel Coorey: Yes, even in that Champions Trophy earlier this year, the way he marshalled the inexperienced attack in that one-day tournament, he’s brilliant.

Kerry O’Keeffe: He’s ahead of the game. Pat relied on him. He was the mind I’m sure he went to if he was compromised. Smith’s always ahead of the game. We lose nothing with him as captain. In fact, we may even be better.

Pat Cummins injury worries: Who should be picked as the backup pace bowler in Australia’s squad?

Charbel Coorey: I agree with that. Onto Cummins, it’s pretty certain he won’t play all the five Tests. Not sure if he’ll even feature at all. We’re probably going to have to bring in another fast bowler in terms of a reserve. Who’s the fast bowler outside of the current big four, including Boland, that you’d like to see next in line?

Kerry O’Keeffe: This is a difficult one. I think that Boland will come in. He’s the fourth. The fifth is probably Brendan Doggett. He’s 31. He’s been in the squad as backup for a while.

He does half iron bends. He swims 1.9 and runs 90k on the bike and 21.1 on the run. He’s the fittest cricketer in Australia. They love the fact that he can keep coming back spell after spell. That’ll be with Harry Brook and Root and people like that. If they get in, they’ll need a bowler like Brendan Doggett to come on and really give them a work over. I think he’s a good choice as the backup.

[Michael] Neser is a little bit conditions dependent because he’s not 140k, but if he does get the nod ahead of Doggett, he probably won’t [play in Perth] because they’ll go in with Boland for Cummins in the first. As backup, Neser is an accomplished swing bowler.

Optus Stadium and the day/night are in Brisbane, his home ground would suit him [Neser] if he was in the mix.

I like Joel Paris. I think his numbers are so good. He takes his first class wickets at under 20. [However], because of his injury proneness, he hasn’t played and that is the problem with him. He’s so often sidelined, but there are swinging conditions at the Optus and in the day/night [in Brisbane].

He’d be an ideal [option], but whether they go with two left arm pacemen, you’re only going to play Paris for two Tests. He couldn’t stand up for five, but whoever leads 2-0 after two is going to win the series. That’s where England will go for the jugular because they’ll know if their pace bowlers can undo Australia in the first two, there’s no coming back.

This is where it’s pulsating to contemplate what might happen in these two games. We need strike and Joel Paris offers strike. But, they won’t risk him because of his injury problems over the years.

Charbel Coorey: I’ll add Fergus O’Neill to that, maybe conditions-based as well. Would you agree? Very good record [134 wickets at 21.12].

Kerry O’Keeffe: He’s a conditions-based bowler, but he’s got a lot of tricks. I see him maybe South Africa 2026, England 2027, inside a squad. Again, at 128k, you’ve got to have tricks. They tell me he’s working on an up-speed ball, but he’ll need it because if nothing’s happening, unless you’ve got something approaching 140k, they’re going to hurt you.

Charbel Coorey: That’s where Doggett might get the nod. I agree with you there. He’s a bit quicker. He’s the sharpest out of the lot. You don’t include Lance Morris, who’s injured at the moment, and Jhye Richardson, who’s just coming back.

Kerry O’Keeffe: Those two would be ahead of Doggett if they’re fully fit, but neither are.

Why this is England’s best chance to win the Ashes down under in over a decade

Charbel Coorey: You mentioned the first two Tests being so important. I think that’s why we’ve got to get our batting lineup in order. If we shift too many guys out of position, it might cause us problems. That being said, I think this is England’s best chance for a while here, as much as that pains me to say. However, they do have some gaps and some flaws to sort out, but would you agree this is their best chance since 2010-11? What are some of the aspects of their game that could get them over the line here?

Kerry O’Keeffe: I agree with you again. I just think the fact that Australia’s having a bat-off to see who will open is a problem because the best campaigns… the plans are already laid down and the team is established. We’re having a bat-off, where every failure means you’re behind the eight ball and every success means you’re a chance.

But as you’ve noted, they’re unsettled as well because they don’t trust Ollie Pope at three and [Jacob] Bethell hasn’t played a lot of First Class cricket and he’s the number three elect. He’s a very good player. He plays like David Gower, as you will have seen, but he’s risky because he has that slicey off-drive that Gower had. It either goes for four or goes to hand.

Their top three will be seen as vulnerable, although [Ben] Duckett is a problem because he’ll hit regular fours if he gets away and he could upset the rhythm of the Australians. But it’ll come down to how they deploy their pacemen as they did in 2010/2011 with Anderson, Tremlett, Finn and Bresnan.

I think they’ll deploy Wood, Archer, Gus Atkinson, Tongue and Stokes for two or three Tests. So it’ll be a carefully strategised Ashes campaign from them where they’re looking to maximise Jofra Archer and Mark Wood for two or three Tests and work Atkinson, Tongue and Stokes around them. So that’ll be interesting how they select what Tests that lot play.

I’m sure if Wood’s fit he’ll play Perth, Archer will play Perth and probably Gus Atkinson plays Perth. And then see what the result is there. Go to the day-nighter in Brisbane. If they’ve all pulled up well, they all go again. And then if England do lead, if it’s 1-all or England lead 2-0, then they can strategise. If Australia lead 2-0, then there’s panic stations.

Charbel Coorey: I think, look, if we bat time, that’s a massive opportunity for us because I’m not convinced by their spinners. I’m not convinced by Shoaib Bashir yet. So if you get him out of the attack and put pressure on him and get miles in the legs of the fast bowlers, that just puts the pressure on England even more. So, onus on our batters big time.

Kerry O’Keeffe: Oh, it does. And that was Graeme Swann did that holding job in 2010/11. He took 15 wickets in that series and he just rested the quicker men because he bowled economic spells.

And as you say, Bashir will be attacked when he comes on. And if they’re taking him at 8-10 and over, it means that Stokes will have to bring the quicker men back on much quicker than he wants to.

So the biggest target of the summer when he plays, and he may not play in Perth, but he’ll play at some stage, will be Bashir. So is he good enough? We haven’t quite seen that yet, but they’re backing him to be the bounce bowler that Nathan Lyon is and bowling on Australian pitches. But I think what’s waiting for them is an absolute onslaught from his very first ball, so that’ll be interesting.

Who are the young talents to watch out for in the coming years in Australia?

Charbel Coorey: No doubt about it. So just the final question, I know you touched on this in the first question around our transition, players retiring at the same time. I know Ricky Ponting spoke about the risk of that with this Australian Test team with a number of players the wrong side of 30. Who are some of the younger talents you think fans can look forward to seeing in the coming years who could be Test candidates in the next couple of years?

Kerry O’Keeffe: Look, it’s a tough one. There’s no prodigy coming through Australian under-19s; they’ve been whitewashed by India. I was disappointed, I was hoping there was an 18-year-old Ponting coming through, but I didn’t see one.

I think Oliver Peake, Victoria, is a very good player. He’s a very wristy player, but he has an ideal temperament and he gets teams over the line. And that’s a big key.

We’ve had dynamic players in the past who get themselves out. This is a fella who can get his team to the winning post. It’s a big trait in the selector’s mind. I think he’ll figure prominently over the years.

I think Sangha, Jason Sangha from South Australia will come again. His best cricket is ahead of him.

He showed so much last summer, particularly in the Shield final where he won the game for South Australia. He plays like Hashim Amla when he’s at his best, but he is a bit slicey outside the off stuff. He’s been nicking off already this summer. It’s a bad sign.

Outside of that, there’s players on the way up. I like the look of Jack Clayton from Queensland. There’s a few around. I tell you who I was impressed with, I just thought this Will Salzmann from New South Wales batted seven in the last game. He’s been an under-19 bowler. He didn’t bowl a ball in this game.

He may have a little back niggle, but he batted seven on debut and got 40 and 70 on a dicey deck. Yeah, they won the game in the end. He’s from Campbelltown, but he plays for Sydney University. I just thought that he showed a very Steve Waugh, rock-solid technique, drove the ball down the ground, got into line, played the spinners well. Apparently, he was injured. I didn’t know he carried an injury into the game, but he wanted to bat seven.

The generation next, I like the look of Callum Vidler who’s a fast bowler. He’s currently injured. I like Mahli Beardman, the 20-year-old Western Australian who’s working with Dennis Lillee. I think his numbers are exceptional already. He’s only played a handful of games, but there’s something about Mahli Beardman. He made an Australia squad. I think they tagged him along. They see him as a future player.

The batting is less convincing. There’s no wonderkid that’s just stood up. The fact that Kurtis Patterson is still a factor at 32. He’s a very good player. Test average of 144, but I just think, do we go there again?

Charbel Coorey: What about Renshaw, Kerry? 29 should be heading into his peak years. I’ve still got a lot of hope for him.

Kerry O’Keeffe: I think he’s a much improved player than he was when he last played, Charbel. You’re right, he’s 29. His List A record is stunning. He could be seen as World Cup 2027.

But the fact he opened the other day with Khawaja [in the Sheffield Shield] was a sign and he got a hundred. I’m sure he could be in the mix.

If it’s not Marnus to open, it could be Renshaw. You never know. He seemed to freeze a little in that innings. I know he’s got so much in this bat off, he knows the value of 100 and he wasn’t as fluent as he’s been in the List A games or for Australia A, because I think the weight of a failure was hurting him, but he didn’t fail. He got a hundred and he’s got another 40 or so today [in a one-dayer against Tasmania on October 9].

He’s definitely in the mix, but I think they’re going to make a determination on him, whether he’s a Test opener or a white-ball middle order, but he wants to play both, of course. I think he used to just be very leg side dominant and now he hits through the offside off the front foot. His front foot defence is much improved, so he doesn’t nick off as much.

But do you go with him at the Optus Stadium, which is a nickers pitch, first up after an absence out of the Test team and then straight to a day/nighter? I think they may err, given Marnus’ early season runs, on the conservative side. Marnus has served us so well in the past. We’re going to trust him to do it again.

Charbel Coorey: Could very well be the case. Well, Kerry, you’re very generous with your answers. Thanks so much for your time. I know how busy you are, so I appreciate it and I look forward to, and we all look forward to listening to you on Fox Cricket this summer. I appreciate it, mate. Thanks so much.

Kerry O’Keeffe: Great to talk to someone who has such a great love of the game, Charbel. Well done, mate.